The Lord of the Rings- J.R.R. Tolkien

Mozart the Meerkitten said:
Nice! I think it looks really good. Its definitely far beyond my meager ablities.:p
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Thanks! I really like it.

And I never had thought about Sam being the good version of Gollum. But now that you mention it, it does actually seem like that is kinda the situation. Has anyone ever read any in depth commentary style books on LOTR. Maybe it has been mentioned as a fact?
 
Hobbit movie

Wow that makes me want to queue up for breakfast at Denny's on 11/6 when it all begins!

On another note, my husband went to a lecture on Tolkien at the Wade Center at Wheaton College this morning, which is a center on research on authors associated with the Inklings. One of the topics touched on was the upcoming Hobbit movie, and how material from the Silmarillion will be incorporated into the forthcoming Hobbit trilogy -- which is one of the reasons why it will be three movies instead of just one. So that means Gandalf's backstory will be interwoven in the films... Can't wait to see how this all plays out!
 
Well technically, a Hobbit meal would include breakfast, second breakfast, luncheon, dinner, tea time, supper, dessert, and probably some others. (Makes me not want to eat anything for days, lol!!)
 
Sauron's Physical Form

To my fellow Ringers.

Can any of you explain why The Necromancer lost his physical form by the War of the Ring? Sauron wasn't destroyed at Dol Guldur. He fled back to Mordor. So why would he discard a body to become the Lidless Eye? I did some investigating via The Lord of the Rings Wiki and it explained that according to the books Gorthaur retained his physical form during the events of the War of the Ring and was in hiding. That the symbol of the Lidless Eye isn't really his spirit.

I however find this quite perplexing. Why would Peter Jackson take such license and claim that the Lidless Eye wreathed in flame is actually Sauron and that he hasn't yet the power to take physical form? I fear there is a discrepancy and I would like to resolve it if I can. Please share any knowledge you may have on this matter.
 

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Its rumored that in the The Hobbit films, the Necromancer is going to be
at the battle of the five armies
 
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Most non hard core fans (like me, I know) don't think of Sauron as having (or having had) a physical form. It's crazy what the movies have done because even though I already read the books, I still think of Sauron as that crazy eye on top of the tower.
 
SG, you would probably have to ask Peter Jackson your question in order to get a good answer. I've never heard him really talk about the reasoning behind making Sauron into an Eye, so I can't assume at his intentions for doing so.

I'm sure that, with all the other liberties he took with the books, he had a good (and logical) reason for doing so. PJ rarely does anything without a good reason for it.
 
BarbarianKing said:
Most non hard core fans (like me, I know) don't think of Sauron as having (or having had) a physical form. It's crazy what the movies have done because even though I already read the books, I still think of Sauron as that crazy eye on top of the tower.
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Having read the Silmarillion, I see Sauron as physical and spiritual threat. I was able to shake the image of the Lidless Eye, because upon reading the books It is only mentioned in passing and there are some character holes regarding Gorthaur. Sauron is destroyed at the Fall of Numenor, he then takes physical form again to be become Annatar, the Forger of the Rings of Power; and is then destroyed at The Last Alliance by Isildur. Then Sauron's spirit is bound to the One Ring that is seized by Bilbo and yet simultaneously The Necromancer (Sauron) is stirring up trouble in Mirkwood. How can Sauron be unable to take physical form and be bound to Baradur when he's also summoning the dead at Dol Guldur? I read on Middle Earth Wiki that Sauron went into hiding after he was chased from Mirkwood. The problem I find is physical form. Sauron I believe could take any shell of flesh he wants, but because his Spirit is bound to the One Ring, he is limited. And yet supposedly his eye is bound to Baradur. I take into account that Tolkien wrote The Hobbit as a stand alone story and that he never intended to write a sequel. So there are plot holes and the rewriting to bridge the The Hobbit with The Lord of the Rings is bound to have issues. I just am so curious about why Sauron if he has physical form as the Necromancer would opt to be an Eye that can only see from Baradur. It seems rather foolish. :confused:
 
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Faleel said:
Remember, The White Council expelled the Necromancer from Dol Guldur during the Hobbit.
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Right, but The One Ring is in Bilbo's possession during The Hobbit and Sauron's physical form was defeated in the Second Age at The Last Alliance. So How can the Necromancer (Sauron in physical form) be expelled when his Spirit is bound to the One Ring that Bilbo finds in Gollum's Cave? The One Ring was with Gollum for five hundred years! That means Sauron hasn't been able to take physical form and yet during the events of the Hobbit he is The Necromancer? :confused:

Sauron's Timeline:

Gorthaur/Sauron destroyed in Numenor -First Age

Annatar/Sauron forges rings of power and is destroyed -Second Age

Necromancer/Sauron at Dol Guldur -Third Age

Sauron/The One Ring -Third Age

Sauron/The Lidless Eye (Baradur) -Third Age

The first two make sense, Sauron is destroyed by Eru Illuvatar (God) when Numenor is destroyed. Then Sauron returns as Annatar to forge the rings of power and returns in physical form and faces Isildur at the Plains of Gorgaroth. Isildur slays Sauron by cutting the One Ring from his hand. Sauron is destroyed again, although we know that his Spirit is bound to the One Ring. Isildur is slain by orcs and the One Ring is lost. Sméagol and Deagol find The One Ring. Gollum keeps The One Ring for 500 years.

[Here is where it gets confusing]

The Necromancer starts his sorcery at Dol Guldur while Bilbo, Thorin & Company are on their adventure. The White Council expels The Necromancer (Sauron) after Bilbo has already found The One Ring. Then after the end of the Hobbit, The One Ring is given to Frodo. Sauron is not seen in physical form, he is the Lidless Eye and is destroyed completely when Gollum falls into Orodruin (Mount Doom's) magma.

The discrepancy is that Sauron is the Necromancer who faces the White Council while Bilbo carries his Spirit in form of the One Ring. Saruman claims that "Sauron cannot yet take physical form, but his spirit has not lost It's potency." (LOTR FOTR).
 
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