The Great Divorce

[Dragonchild]

Does anybody know - and favour - this little jewel in the fields of literature by C.S. Lewis?

[PrinceOfTheWest]

Oh, I'm very familiar with it - it's one of my favorite stories, and an excellent example of how literature can be analogical without being an analogy. The little vignettes provide such a window into all our lives and personalities!

[inkspot]

Is this the one with the man on the bus to heaven? I love that one.
:)

[KathrynJanewayChakotay]

A great book i really enjoyed it really gave you insight into stuff you ddin't realize in your own life

[Benisse]

Lewis was a master at capturing the truth through fantasy, like in the Great Divorce which illuminates human nature through the encounters between lost souls given a 2nd chance with key persons from their past. It was brilliant the way he revealed how the phantom characters' excuses for not responding to God were such at odds with what they said they valued. In addition there were some unforgettable characters, like the Great Lady or the poor phantom who would not give up his pet sin and had such an unfortunate end. I also really love the way he can make an imaginary world seem so real, like the details of the intensely substantive grass, or when the narrator tried to take a shortcut across the stream and it was like trying to walk on moving, bouncing glass! This little book is a gem...
Blessings, Benisse

[lieke]

This is one of my favorite books. I was so happy when one of the 'ghosts' or 'shades' (i don't know how they are called in the English version) let the Angle kill that thing, and he turned into a 'real man', who could walk the grass, and who could go 'further up and further in'. And it shows so many of the mistakes people can make and actually make. And then again, the writing style was great.

[Son of Adam]

This was the first book by C.S. Lewis that I read, and it is still one of my favorites of his. It's one bus ride I will not have to worry about, praise the Lord.

[glum_of_the_marsh]

It is only recently that I read this marvellous book for the first time.

C S Lewis' own favourite of his own work, I gather -- and deservedly so.

I'm not so sure that I will be certain of a good destination for myself on this bus -- only hope, not certainty.

:)

[Copperfox]

Greetings, Glum-Of!

There is disputation to this day about the doctrine of "eternal security"--the belief that once we say the words "I believe in Jesus," we have a guaranteed free ticket to Heaven NO MATTER WHAT we do. But if accepting Jesus as our Savior does not mean eternal security strictly in this sense, it's as close to it as we need. Even if it IS possible for us, after gaining a relationship with God, to lose it, God will never make it EASY for us to lose it. He is FOR us, not against us. He wants us to succeed, not to fail. Thus the famous Parable of the Prodigal Son: the title character of this parable in Luke's Gospel had offended against his loving father VERY badly, treating the father with contempt and dishonoring the family name--but the father still was not only willing to forgive him, but DELIGHTED to have the relationship restored.

The fact that "The Great Divorce" metaphorically shows some lost souls being saved AFTER death--not something we should count on in reality!--reflects Mr. Lewis' understanding of God's merciful nature. Even in the Old Testament, before Jesus had come to pay for our sins, God said to the prophet Ezekiel, "As surely as I live, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they should turn from their way and live."

So you can have, not only a forlorn hope, but a strong confidence, that God is on your side--that He will be at work to HELP you toward Heaven, rather than planting landmines to PREVENT you from getting there.


Oh, while I'm thinking of it: in spite of the atheistic leanings of the "Doctor Who" series, there must have been someone among the writers who had read "The Great Divorce"....because the Great Lady is named Sarah Smith, and lived on Earth at Golders Green, England. The Doctor Who character Sarah JANE Smith was once referred to as living at Golders Green also!

[Gibby]

I read this book while on vacation this summer....good read. It makes me thankful for soft grass. ;)

[Copperfox]

"The Great Divorce" is actually the first C.S. Lewis book I ever HEARD OF, back before I was even old enough to READ his work with comprehension. And yes, it DOES make one appreciate flexible grass.

[waterhogboy]

I just read this book and thought it were brill!!! Very moving in places and very interesting to think about.

[BarbarianKing]

"The Great Divorce" is actually the first C.S. Lewis book I ever HEARD OF, back before I was even old enough to READ his work with comprehension. And yes, it DOES make one appreciate flexible grass.
I would actually look for something very soft to sit or lay on when reading this book. I could feel the hurt from that stiff grass.

[Copperfox]

The way I first heard about The Great Divorce was that the eldest of my birth sisters had read it as an English-class assignment. Back then, you actually still could read a Christian book in a public high school.

[Liz]

I read "The Great Divorce" some years ago, and remember it as very good and inspiring.
Especially I remember a man, who has some creature sitting on his shoulder. This creature is turned into a horse. That image has stuck in my mind.

[PrinceOfTheWest]

That was a very powerful vignette. The oily lizard represented lust, and once its back was broken, it turned into the glorious steed which carried the man over the horizon to the sunlit lands.

Lewis had such a powerful imagination!

[BarbarianKing]

I read "The Great Divorce" some years ago, and remember it as very good and inspiring.
Especially I remember a man, who has some creature sitting on his shoulder. This creature is turned into a horse. That image has stuck in my mind.
That was one of my favorite ones!

[Copperfox]

I loved the scene where Lewis imagines himself seeing the glory of an approaching female saint. She is so radiant that Lewis mistakes her for the Mother of Jesus; then MacDonald tells him that she is "only" Sarah Smith from Golders Green. ("Ye will have heard that fame on Earth and fame up here are two different things.")

Despite the ingrained anti-faith bias of the "Doctor Who" series, one of its writers MUST have been a Lewis reader--because Sarah Jane Smith, one of the Doctor's most popular sidekicks, was said to be from Golders Green!

[Sven-El]

very true... it's kind of like the number of references to CS Lewis and the Great Divorce that are made in LOST. ( though in that case it also helps further the idea that they are in Purgatory.)

And actually CF, not to disagree with you, but I was more then able to read the Great Divorce and a number of other Christian books in Public High School, granted it was for elective reading purposes, but it still counts. I even chose CS Lewis as an important historical figure to portray in my Advanced Placement History Class. ( That was actually how I discovered NarniaFans, as i was doing reseach on Lewis.)

[Copperfox]

I'm happy that you have that freedom. I've just seen too much of public schools which literally forbid any mention at all of the Biblical God, yet DO allow unrestrained discussion of witchcraft and tribal paganism.

[Beloved]

The way I first heard about The Great Divorce was that the eldest of my birth sisters had read it as an English-class assignment. Back then, you actually still could read a Christian book in a public high school.

I read a Frank Peretti book at a public school my senior year with no problems. :) I read The Great Divorce about a year or so ago... I felt like I was on a trip... but it would've helped if I'd noticed, BEFORE the last pages, that it was about a dream. I thought Lewis was off his rocker the whole time and it was hard to stay with it because of that. :)

[inkspot]

I read a Frank Peretti book at a public school my senior year with no problems. :) I read The Great Divorce about a year or so ago... I felt like I was on a trip... but it would've helped if I'd noticed, BEFORE the last pages, that it was about a dream. I thought Lewis was off his rocker the whole time and it was hard to stay with it because of that. :)
LOL! That must have been funny. Welcome, Beloved. I don't remember seeing you post before. I love your avi!

I love the Sarah Smith vignette in GD because she's so sweet to her dwarfy little husband. It breaks my heart that he chooses his grand delusions of himself rather than going with her ...

[Copperfox]

"If it were possible, I would enter Hell to help you; but you cannot bring Hell into me."


I love it that Sarah Smith's evil husband was NOT allowed, in the end, to spoil the happiness which was her reward in Heaven.

[Beloved]

LOL! That must have been funny. Welcome, Beloved. I don't remember seeing you post before. I love your avi!

I love the Sarah Smith vignette in GD because she's so sweet to her dwarfy little husband. It breaks my heart that he chooses his grand delusions of himself rather than going with her ...

Thanks, I'm new. ;) Copperfox dragged me here, kicking and screaming.

The avi is my guinea pig, Sty. He's a character.

I don't remember much about the GD except that I thought I was reading the CS Lewis version of something along the lines of "Alice in Wonderland" (ie: rather trippy) and I remember how absolutely stunned/enlightened I felt when I got to the last page and it all came together as a strange dream. It would've been nice to've known that all along! ::wah wah::

[waterhogboy]

I love it that Sarah Smith's evil husband was NOT allowed, in the end, to spoil the happiness which was her reward in Heaven.

I see you're mirroring the Christian attitude of Sarah Smith herself there!!

I feel sorry for him. It shows how so many people can let their self-conciousness get too great and become a form of pride in itself. It's obvious that the man's problem was that he never really felt loved, not because he wasn't, but because he wouldn't believe anyone would love him.

I find it really depressing, especially when we see them share the joke and there is hope on the horizon, but then the dark clouds of his inferiority complex descend back in and choke all the efforts of Sarah to show him how much she, and Christ, loved the man. I found this one of the most moving parts of the book.

[PrinceOfTheWest]

It was moving and very powerful. I loved how Lewis made clear that Sarah Smith still loved her husband, but the fact that he chose destruction could cast no cloud on her joy. "I am in Love, and will not go out of it" - that has to be one of the most powerfully poetic lines in literature.

[inkspot]

Sarah's loving example is so sweet ... she doesn't get nasty with him (as I would be inclined to do) when he tried to make her feel guilty ... she just patiently, gently, continues to try to show him the truth, and cover him with her love ... I like her example very much and have often in my life tried to remember it and imitate her.

[TimmyofOz]

You must remember that Lewis made a point in the book that many who we think love us actually have little or no love at all. For if they did have any true love for us there would be hope for them. We saw this in the mother of Michael and the wife of Robert. In some ways Sarah's husband had more hope than the other two I mentioned for Sarah came to him, and it looked like she could have suceeded. It is sad to find out those who you thought loved you never did.

[Beloved]

You must remember that Lewis made a point in the book that many who we think love us actually have little or no love at all. For if they did have any true love for us there would be hope for them. We saw this in the mother of Michael and the wife of Robert. In some ways Sarah's husband had more hope than the other two I mentioned for Sarah came to him, and it looked like she could have suceeded. It is sad to find out those who you thought loved you never did.

Depressing, but so true.

[Copperfox]

The selfish person may "love" us both in the sense of believing us to be good, and in the sense of desiring a benefit from us--yet NOT love us in the sense of being willing to sacrifice for us. This distinction was part of Mr. Lewis' theme in The Four Loves.

[Beloved]

I'd like to read that book (The Four Loves). It's on my list. :)

[TimmyofOz]

Cf, this love is merely where a person is getting some inner passion or desire which is satisfied by your presence. That person might as will be Pavlov's dog, merely reacting to the situation they are in while in your presence. You might think they truely love you but their loving actions toward us are just conditioned reflexes to receive a goal. That is why Lewis in TGD could find no way to save this person. There was no spiritaul love just a base lust. True love is only of God and God in a person's life.

[Beloved]

Cf, this love is merely where a person is getting some inner passion or desire which is satisfied by your presence. That person might as will be Pavlov's dog, merely reacting to the situation they are in while in your presence. You might think they truely love you but their loving actions toward us are just conditioned reflexes to receive a goal. That is why Lewis in TGD could find no way to save this person. There was no spiritaul love just a base lust. True love is only of God and God in a person's life.

Good insight. Thanks for sharing.

[Copperfox]

The evil husband had not had ONLY a sexual lust toward his wife, but also a desire to keep her always in a position of supposed moral inferiority to himself, so as to feed his inflated ego.

[TimmyofOz]

I didn't mean that kind of lust. More like the bases of instincts. In the case of the bad husband the instinct is to just be dominant.

[inkspot]

The selfish person may "love" us both in the sense of believing us to be good, and in the sense of desiring a benefit from us--yet NOT love us in the sense of being willing to sacrifice for us. This distinction was part of Mr. Lewis' theme in The Four Loves.
Yah, this is the sense I get from Mr. Smith. I imagine in life he was proud to be the husband of such an adored woman, but never really understood how what she did was what made people adore her ... he loved her, I like to think, as best he could with his damaged sense of self. But he loved his own idea of himself as a Big Man more than he loved her. It's very sad. :(

[Benisse]

Sarah's loving example is so sweet ... she doesn't get nasty with him (as I would be inclined to do) when he tried to make her feel guilty ... she just patiently, gently, continues to try to show him the truth, and cover him with her love ... I like her example very much and have often in my life tried to remember it and imitate her.

What a beautiful thought -- Especially now for me when I am being really stretched in caring for my mom I am learning how much more I have to learn about real love. I will need to go back and review how Sarah related to her husband, to learn from her example too.

[inkspot]

Their story may be the last one in the series of encounters the narrator has in the book, but the whole book is worth a read.

[Copperfox]

I love the scene with the apostate clergyman who pretends he was "heroic" to deny the Deity of Jesus, when he had actually known that he was in a setting where this denial would only make him MORE popular.

[inkspot]

I love the scene with the apostate clergyman who pretends he was "heroic" to deny the Deity of Jesus, when he had actually known that he was in a setting where this denial would only make him MORE popular.
LOL! Yes -- it is exactly how people behave today, as if they have somehow thrown off the shackles and are boldy standing out as individuals when they deny that their is a God, as if they're evolving into great new freedom where few dar to go ... and in fact they're just following the crowd who think it's cool to pretend to debunk religion.