discussion

[jen15]

what do you think about Aslan telling Su and Peter they can not return to Narnia again?
i personally, cried when i read it. i was so mad at Aslan and the books.
because of that and in the next book when he tell the same to Lucy and Ed, i never felt the same for Aslan. kind of stupid ha?
what do you think?

[PrinceOfTheWest]

what do you think about Aslan telling Su and Peter they can not return to Narnia again?
i personally, cried when i read it. i was so mad at Aslan and the books.
because of that and in the next book when he tell the same to Lucy and Ed, i never felt the same for Aslan. kind of stupid ha?
what do you think?Read carefully at the end of Dawn Treader. Aslan tells Lucy and Edmund that He has another Name in our world, and they must get to know Him by that Name. He hasn't left them at all - they just have to walk the remainder of their mortal lives exclusively in our world instead of back-and-forth between our world and Narnia.

Of course, they do get back to Narnia - you've read Last Battle, right?

[Hope96]

I was sad about them not being allowed back into Narnia....but it never crossed my mind to be upset with Aslan because of it.

[unleavened]

Yeah, I was upset. I was kinda miffed we had to switch charcaters when I was a kid, b/c I liked the pevensies to well. However, I ended up liking the other characters just as well, so I got over it. When the came back in LB all was better. (Except for the Susan issue, but that's another thread!)

[SK21]

I agree i never liked the switch over, still don't because i can't get the hang of Eustace and i love the Pevensies. Must read LB again because i keep forgetting whats happened. lol

[Jacksie]

I was upset at first, but when Peter (i think) told Ed and Lucy that it was ok, then it was ok with me.

[polly&digory]

finish reading the books! They go back but i think it has something to do with becoming an adult. We believe things when we are young but not as easily when we are older. As Susan ends up, not believing in Narnia.

[onlymystory]

it helps to like eustace better if you go back and just read the part of VOTDT when he tells edmund about being a dragon. It was what made me finally like Eustace. And in addition to what POTW said, Aslan tells the children that they got to know him a little in Narnia so they would know him better in their own world. (as Jesus). And finally, Jewel tells either Jill or Eustace in the Last Battle that in between times, there is great peace and joy in Narnia. The humans only come in when Narnia is in trouble. WHich is also probably why they don't get to come very often. (Several of the books they are called actually by others in Narnia, not by aslan. Although Aslan gets them there.)

[elfjad]

It's all well and good knowing Jesus better in our world but why can't adults or, I for that matter, get to see fauns and satyrs etc. I wanted to see some centaurs! And I don't understand why Peter and Susan were told they were too old to get in when the ancestors of the Telmarines entered Narnia as grown-ups. Anyone know?

[Rhyanidd]

the telemarines didnt get into narnia they got into a neiboring country also they sorta needed it they were going to be murdered and maybe they werent all that bad, also I think maybe they couldnt come back to Narnia because they had gotten all they could from it, say like as a child a 'fairy tale' satisfys our thirst for adventure but then when we are older about 11-12 or something we need more then 'the prince kissed the princess and she woke up and they lived happily ever after' we want something a little bit more tense, so maybe when the children were told they couldnt come back that meant 'that they would be bored with these stories' or something like that do you understand or am I rambling? so thats just what I think, Lucy and Ed and Susan and Peter had gotten all they could learn from this world and as to being to old maybe that meant they were mentally to old, cuz isnt Eustace EDS age? and he comes back....right? so umm do you understand what I am ssaying?

[onlymystory]

no edmund and eustace are not the same age. Lucy and Edmund are both older than Eustace and Jill.

[Corin Thunder-Fist]

I don't think the book directly tells the age difference, but it does allude to it.

"Eustace Clarence disliked his cousins, the four Pevensies--Peter, Susan, Edmund and Lucy. But he was quite glad when he heard that Edmund and Lucy were coming to stay. For deep down inside he liked bossing and bullying; and, though he was a puny little person who couldn't have stood up even to Lucy, let alone Edmund, in a fight, he knew that there are dozens of ways to give people a bad time if you are in your own home and they are only visitors."


Either he's a beardless dwarf of he's younger than even Lucy, though he tries to act older. Lucy's a dreamer and Eustace is an intellectual, so it may seem at times that Eustace could be older.

I think the age barrier holds up for entrance into Narnia as the reason.

[onlymystory]

it says in LB that Jill and Eustace were the only ones still in school. So Lucy has to be older.

[masterofmonks]

I personallty feel that it has to do with the way children belive things. As we get older we find it harder to beilve in thing just because they are true, instead we need proof that they are true, and this occludes us from the fact. Since I have become an adult I have often longed for the ability to belive things the way I used to. However through time I have become jaded, and cycical. To belive as a child belives is the greatest gift we are ever given, and for a while these writings allow me to belive in God, and love and kindness, the way I used to. Some of us outgrow beliving because thigs are true, and some of us need to find the truth on our own, and still others never truely forget.

[stronger_WM]

Yeah, I was upset. I was kinda miffed we had to switch charcaters when I was a kid, b/c I liked the pevensies to well.

EXACTLY! I have only read LWW and I just finished PC last night, but I don't how they switch to different characters. I know they come back in LB, but I wanted them to stay with them the whole time. Because I got attached to them, and I don't feel like I will like the other characters as much :( Plus in the movies, I hate to say it, but I just like the original people so much that i don't want to see new ones. Plus I like Peter and Susan A LOT so the fact that Peter doesn't come back until the last one and Susan never does makes me :(

[Corin Thunder-Fist]

EXACTLY! I have only read LWW and I just finished PC last night, but I don't how they switch to different characters. I know they come back in LB, but I wanted them to stay with them the whole time. Because I got attached to them, and I don't feel like I will like the other characters as much :( Plus in the movies, I hate to say it, but I just like the original people so much that i don't want to see new ones. Plus I like Peter and Susan A LOT so the fact that Peter doesn't come back until the last one and Susan never does makes me :(

You need to keep an open mind and continue to read them. While I like the Pevensie children, I feel the STORY is better in the ones that they aren't included in. Actually, I would say that my 3 favorite stories in the series...only 1 of them has the Pevensies, and they aren't even the main characters in it (HHB).

There are several new characters introduced in the other books that are worth reading about.

[DeplorableWord]

the telemarines didnt get into narnia they got into a neiboring country also they sorta needed it they were going to be murdered and maybe they werent all that bad, also I think maybe they couldnt come back to Narnia because they had gotten all they could from it, say like as a child a 'fairy tale' satisfys our thirst for adventure but then when we are older about 11-12 or something we need more then 'the prince kissed the princess and she woke up and they lived happily ever after' we want something a little bit more tense, so maybe when the children were told they couldnt come back that meant 'that they would be bored with these stories' or something like that do you understand or am I rambling? so thats just what I think, Lucy and Ed and Susan and Peter had gotten all they could learn from this world and as to being to old maybe that meant they were mentally to old, cuz isnt Eustace EDS age? and he comes back....right? so umm do you understand what I am ssaying?

Aslan says that the main reason that he brought the kids to Narnia was because he wanted them to be able to know him, esp. in their own world. The kids were old enough and knew Aslan well enough to know him outside of Narnia without any more help from him in Narnia; I think having the kids in Narnia was just Aslan's way of giving the kids a "push" at knowing him better in their own world.


Even if Eustace and edmund were the same age, Edmund was in a sense "older" than Eustace in his knowledge of Aslan and his capability to follow him and know him better in the "real world"- maybe Eustace wasn't ready yet.

[Phinix]

Well as it stands Edmond was 10 in LWW summer ended...so PC he was still 10 unless he has a late summer B-day so early 11...
In DT after Eustace was un dragoned demond says Younger than him but to big to be Lucy which makes me think E.C. was 9-10.

[Deeper_Wonderment]

The Telemarines were never "called" into Narnia...they just kinda blundered their way there. (Does anyone else find it interesting that Telemarine, consisting of "tele-" meaning "far-off" and "marine" meaning "Of or relating to the sea," descibes where the Telemarines came from? Pirates from a sea in our world which is very far off indeed. And not only that, but that they eventually became afraid of the sea?) And in Prince Caspian, Aslan offers to right that blunder.

As for the children - from Diggory to Jill - they all belong in our world. They had families and destinies and such to carry on here, and I think that's why Aslan didn't let them stay forever.

[unleavened]

That's right DW! They had a purpose in this world.

I never considered the makeup of Telemarine before. That's interesting.

[Deeper_Wonderment]

I didn't consider it either until I read this discussion thread. As for the cousins, Edmund was born in 1930, Lucy in 1932, Eustace in 1933 as was Jill...who's not a cousin per se. :P

[stronger_WM]

I didn't consider it either until I read this discussion thread. As for the cousins, Edmund was born in 1930, Lucy in 1932, Eustace in 1933 as was Jill...who's not a cousin per se. :P
I thought Edmund was older than 10 in the movie.

[stronger_WM]

You need to keep an open mind and continue to read them. While I like the Pevensie children, I feel the STORY is better in the ones that they aren't included in. Actually, I would say that my 3 favorite stories in the series...only 1 of them has the Pevensies, and they aren't even the main characters in it (HHB).

There are several new characters introduced in the other books that are worth reading about.

Thanks. Yeah I am GOING to finish the series (im reading it in published order, that way everything is explained last) But yes, i am excited to see how everything turns out. Right now I'm like on page 50 of VDT.

[Deeper_Wonderment]

He definitely looks older in the movies - they all do - but in the books those are their ages...and speaking of ages, do you know that Caspian is 13 when he becomes high king of Narnia? The same age Peter was? :D

[onlymystory]

where did you get those birthdates?

[Deeper_Wonderment]

where did you get those birthdates?

I have this wonderful book called "A Book of Narnians: The Lion, the Witch, and the Others." In the back it has "CS Lewis' Outline of Narnian History." Down one side of the page is Narnian time, and the other "our time." So for example, Peter was born in 1927 our time, and the corresponding Narnian year is 204, the year that "certain outlaws from Archenland fly across the southern desert and set up the new kingdom of Calormen."

[PrinceOfTheWest]

That timeline has cropped up in other places on this forum, and has been a topic of some dispute. It's orginal source was a book called Past Watchful Dragons, written by Walter Hooper. Supposedly it's from some unpublished manuscripts that Lewis wrote which Hooper, as his "personal secretary" put together after his death. Problem is that some serious Lewis scholars have raised valid questions about Hooper's honesty and legitimacy (e.g. Hooper several times claimed to be Lewis' "longtime personal secretary", when in fact he only worked in that capacity for some weeks, and that toward the end of Lewis' life). Some have even raised the claim that Hooper was publishing some works of his own under Lewis' name (e.g. the story The Dark Tower - for further details, see The C.S. Lewis Hoax (http://www.lindentree.org/hoax.html) by the late Kathryn Lindskoog (http://www.lindentree.org/cslewis.html)).

Point being that this supposed timeline contradicts some details of the Narnia stories, as well as inventing completely new things that don't seem to square with Lewis' style (e.g. the contention that the men of Telmar were at one point turned into dumb beasts en masse - not very Lewisian.) It's possible that this timeline was sketched out by Lewis himself, and we just have to deal with the fact that he wasn't consistent about his stories. But when the only source for the thing is Walter Hooper, a man whom true Lewis scholars like Sheldon Vanauken consider to be a weak reed - well, I've got my doubts.

[CSLewisFan]

I remember feeling shocked and very sad for Susan and Peter when I first read the books when I was wee little.

But like Prince of the West said, if you read carefully in the Voyage of the Dawn Treader, it really isn't as simple as they just never come back.

If you read the Last Battle I think your in for a pleasant surprise.

-Austin

[pavender]

As Reepicheepfan said, the Telmarines NEEDED to get away from where they were. They were three families of pirates stuck on an island in a cave about to be murdered by other pirates - but they ran into a cave and that is how they came to Telmar. I think every time someone goes to Narnia there is a reason - for eg. King Frank and Queen Helen came to Narnia because it needed it's first king and queen. Obviously when some get too old to go to Narnia they are told they can't return - but it's OK, because the next time Narnia needs somebody, Aslan already has a child he can call on to help. I believe that for eg. that is why Eustace comes to the Dawntreader with Edmund and Lucy, because Aslan knows that is the last time Edmund and Lucy can go, but he knows a Son of Adam and a Daughter of Eve will be needed during The Silver Chair and The Last Battle. So he lets Eustace "get to know" Narnia with his cousins, so that Eustace can help Jill "get to know" Narnia during The Silver Chair. Then, during the Last Battle, when they come there is no mucking around - no shock, they already know about Narnia, so when Narnia needs them the most they can get straight to work.

Now I'm rambling, lol. :)

[MTMFan]

I've only read as far as PC, so I can't speak about the later characters, but I didn't have a problem with Susan and Peter not coming back to Narnia. They were only called to Narnia to serve a specific purpose, and now that purpose had been fulfulled. I'm sure they had things to do in our world, so they wanted to come back.

[Aslan's Beloved Daughter]

I think that him telling them that they cannot ever come back to Narnia is pretty harsh. I would totally want to stay!

[Aslan's Beloved Daughter]

But I still love Him! ;)