Telmarine Castle/Cair Paravel

[Lady of the Lion's Mane]

I wasn't sure where to put this, so if it needs to be moved, mods feel free. :D

So, I'm re-reading the Chronicles, and am currently on VDT, and notice that it is now said that Caspian (and Trumpkin who is staying behind in Narnia) is now living in Cair Paravel. (Aslan later says he must go visit Trumpkin there.)

Obviously, in PC, just 3 years prior, Cair Paravel was in ruins. Soooooo....did they rebuild it? What happened to the Telmarine Castle? I glanced in SC and LB to see, and everyone's living at Cair Paravel in those, too.

So, if anyone knows or has any ideas, please share. Was Cair Paravel rebuilt/what happened to the Telmarine Castle? :confused:

[Hylian Princess]

Beats me! I've always wondered about that. :confused:

[Eärendil the Mariner]

I wasn't sure where to put this, so if it needs to be moved, mods feel free. :D

So, I'm re-reading the Chronicles, and am currently on VDT, and notice that it is now said that Caspian (and Trumpkin who is staying behind in Narnia) is now living in Cair Paravel. (Aslan later says he must go visit Trumpkin there.)

Obviously, in PC, just 3 years prior, Cair Paravel was in ruins. Soooooo....did they rebuild it? What happened to the Telmarine Castle? I glanced in SC and LB to see, and everyone's living at Cair Paravel in those, too.

So, if anyone knows or has any ideas, please share. Was Cair Paravel rebuilt/what happened to the Telmarine Castle? :confused:

I would say they destroyed the Telmarine castle & rebuilt Cair Paravel. Just a guess though.;)

[Aslan'sFriend410]

I've always thought they'd rebuild Cair. No book proof to back it up though, that I can think of at the moment.

[~Lava~]

They re-built Cair (like some one said people were living in it during VotDT and Silver Chair), that is for sure, possibly even with Aslan's help. The movie implies a more destroyed Cair than the book does, it would have been easier to rebuild the book's ruins (it still had a good many walls) than the movie's. I see no reason for them to destroy Miraz's castle though, think of how many palaces England has that were completely dedicated to use by the royal family for hundreds of years.

[BarbarianKing]

I know this guy who knows this guy whose uncle worked in a construction company..... just kidding.

of course they had to have rebuild Cair Paravel. There is no question about it. Remember that Caspian and all of the younger generation liked the idea of old Narnia coming back again, as told in their legends. Obviously, Cair Paravel was a central part of Old Narnia.

[Mrs. Pevensie]

I know this guy who knows this guy whose uncle worked in a construction company..... just kidding.

of course they had to have rebuild Cair Paravel. There is no question about it. Remember that Caspian and all of the younger generation liked the idea of old Narnia coming back again, as told in their legends. Obviously, Cair Paravel was a central part of Old Narnia.

I agree...it is obvious that Cair Paravel was rebuilt at some point.

[Ephinie]

This is one of those questions that when I was a small child and reading Narnia, it never occurred to me to ask. I just took it for granted that they had rebuilt Cair Paravel - they would have had to in order to have it functional. But you are right, the books never make specific reference to it being rebuilt. There are a lot of interesting "gaps" in the Narnia books that I notice now. But you know what? I never questioned any of it when I read them as a child. I was six the first time I read them; and every single gap that I find NOW, I seem to already have an explanation for in my mind - an explanation that I just assumed subconciously when I first read them.

So it seems to me that this kind of "gap" really isn't a gap at all to C.S. Lewis. He was writing for children, and it seems that children can see through and fill in the gaps naturally without a second thought.

For purpose of the movie for VotDT, I don't think it will be hard to explain this for the screen audience, either. When Caspian is catching Lucy and Edmund up on the past three years of his reign, they can just throw in a line about, "Oh yeah, re-build Cair Paravel, too."

[Lady of the Lion's Mane]

I was thinking that they rebuilt Cair Paravel, but what about the Telmarine Castle? I wonder what it's used for now? And rebuilding Cair Paravel in only 3 years, then building a ship to go to the Utter East? Wow. Talk about some nice accomplishments. :D

[Emily]

I am not quite sure.. but I would have thought that they would have redid it. But I have always wandered that and I have no clue.:confused:

[~Lava~]

Well, if Aslan helped them it is not as though rebuilding Cair would have taken too long, besides, if they had two crews working, both Cair's rebuilding and the Dawn Treader's building could have coincided. The book never said how Cair was built, let alone rebuilt. It seems to me that without Aslan's help they would never have gotten it right anyways because the only people (said to mean human and the Old Narnians not Aslan) who knew what Cair looked like for sure left within three days of winning the battle.

[Hylian Princess]

I was thinking that they rebuilt Cair Paravel, but what about the Telmarine Castle? I wonder what it's used for now? And rebuilding Cair Paravel in only 3 years, then building a ship to go to the Utter East? Wow. Talk about some nice accomplishments.

Well, "In Narnia....anything is possible!" - CS Lewis

:D

[Knight of Narnia]

We know that when the Pevensies arrive in Narnia at the beginning of PC, they find Cair Paravel in ruins.

I was wondering when Cair Paravel was rebuilt. I believe that it was rebuilt sometime between VoDT and SC, but it might have been earlier. I don't remember Caspian mentioning Cair Paravel in VoDT, but it was mentioned at the start of SC.

[MrBob]

Aslan mentions Cair Paravel in VotDT. After Lucy reads from the Magician's book, he tells Lucy that he will tell Trumpkin of her story at Cair Paravel.

It was apparently a quick build, around three years, but we do not know if it was at the same site as the old Cair Paravel.

Bob

[~Lava~]

I think that it was probably done by magic at the will of Aslan.

[Knight of Narnia]

That's right! I forgot about Aslan talking about Trumpkin. Good call Mr. Bob.

I also agree with Lava, that Aslan probably helped rebuild Cair Paravel. Maybe he could have used some of the deep magic that created Narnia in the first place. If trees can grow from seeds and Lamp posts can grow from metal poles, it is plausible that Aslan "regrew" Cair Paravel from its ruins.

[Silmarien]

Yes, I always thought Caspian rebuilt Cair Paravel, too. It's a special place for him and reminds him of Narnia's glorious past, I guess that's why he did it. The Telmarine Castle, on the other hand, reminds him of his uncle Miraz and his rather unhappy childhood. I guess it was just neglected and - being not cared for any more - just fell into ruin. Unless...well, perhaps people DID find another use for it and looked after it. Nothing like that is mentioned in the books, though.

Another thing that comes to my mind talking about Cair Paravel: It was on an island when the Pevensies arrived there for the second time. Do you think Caspian somehow connected that island to the mainland by building a bridge?

[Silmarien]

I don't think Aslan "regrew" Cair Paravel. He said in MN that the magic that still lingered in the air would soon cease to be there, meaning that no lamppost would grow to a streetlamp when thrown to the ground any more. Of course, he certainly would have the power to "regrow" Cair Paravel, but when Lucy meets him in Coriakin's house he says he obeys his own laws (like being invisible on that island) - I somehow don't think he would suddenly act all differently.

However, I certainly believe that Aslan helped in rebuilding the castle. Perhaps he showed them how to do it, what it had looked like or something. It's just that thought of "obvious magic" (like saying a word and - pop - the castle is rebuilt) I find highly improbable.

[~Lava~]

Probably they did build a bridge. I don't think they would abandon the Telmarine (not Miraz's Castle, Caspian the 7th, 8th, and 9th's Castle), It would become another castle for them to be in while they are not at Cair. Maybe a winter dwelling for Caspian.

[~Lava~]

I don't think he re-grew it but, the Bacchanalia was able at, a single word, to turn a building into a forest glen. I would imagine that part of the healing of Narnia that Aslan took part in involved Cair.

[Catherine]

I think that it was probably done by magic at the will of Aslan.

i think so too, i wonder when exactly he did it though? sometime during the three years (narnian years) between the time the Pevensies left and when Lucy and edmund come back.

[~Lava~]

Perhaps it was done on Caspian's Coronation day, so that he could "rule by the will of Aslan and sit at Cair Paravel on the throne of Peter the High King" (quote from "The Disappearance of Jill" in the Chronicles of Narnia: The Silver Chair). That is how I always imagined it happening at least.

[Knight of Narnia]

I was just reading Timbalionguy's wonderful fanfic The Lion's Share (http://www.narniafans.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17980) and I got to the part where the animals and dwarves were all helping to build Cair Paravel for the first time. I would imagine that they were able to rebuild Cair Paravel in the same way that it was built the first time.

[MrBob]

I can't imagine Aslan helped with the rebuilding of Cair Paravel. He is not the sort who would be directly involved in the mundane events such as building things. He did not help with the building of the original Cair, so why help now?

I wonder if they found the original plans for the building of Cair Paravel. Or did he add some Telmarine touches to the new Cair Paravel?

MrBob

[Elentari]

Whether or not Aslan helped, Cair Paravel was definitely rebuilt before Caspian's Voyage. AND I believe it to be the same location "by the sea". I've never been sure how Cair Paravel was built the first time (and I guess according to Knight of Narnia only fan fiction will tell), but I always wondered how the prophecy came to be and four thrones were put in before the White Witch took over. Obviously when it was built the second time there was only one throne, unless one was built for the Queen.

I imagine the second Cair Paravel would be slightly different than the first--it looked different on the inside in the BBC version anyway--but I like to imagine Caspian tried to bring it back to it's former glory as much as possible.

[waterhogboy]

Both these threads had the same subject so iMerge.

[kingcaspian]

I believe that the Telmarine castle was simply temporary until they could rebuild Cair Paravel. I mean, the Telm. castle probably wasn't even all that nice anyway. Lewis simply didn't mention the fact that Cair was rebuilt by the Narnians because he wasn't a detailed writer(like Tolkien was) and knew the readers would know that Caspian had rebuild Cair.

[Catherine]

Despite the fact that four thrones wouldn't really be needed during Caspian's reign and those to follow, i always imagined that it still had the four thrones, and that it was just the smae as it was in the Pevensie's time, and that it was still the same old Cair without any changes. though now that i think of it would be rather odd to be sitting in the throne room with two or three empty thrones sitting beside you. and i guess he probably did make some other changes. Nothing large i hope though, and not many.

[~Lava~]

I think he would have kept four thrones, after all, he was ruling on the throne of the High King.

[Catherine]

that's true, maybe he did keep the four thrones.

[Elentari]

he was ruling on the throne of the High King.

Yet he was also UNDER the High King, since only Peter is ever called the "High King". I'm not sure about the thrones. I like the idea of keeping the 4, but it would seem rather lonely sitting up there with 3 empty thrones around you all the time.

[waterhogboy]

Maybe they would have kept the 4 and put a new one in front, retaining the memory of the high king and co but not attempting to usurp or get rid of them!?

[Elentari]

Maybe they would have kept the 4 and put a new one in front, retaining the memory of the high king and co but not attempting to usurp or get rid of them!?

Oooo, now THAT is a cool idea! :D

[Spare Oomian]

I wasn't sure where to put this, so if it needs to be moved, mods feel free. :D

So, I'm re-reading the Chronicles, and am currently on VDT, and notice that it is now said that Caspian (and Trumpkin who is staying behind in Narnia) is now living in Cair Paravel. (Aslan later says he must go visit Trumpkin there.)

Obviously, in PC, just 3 years prior, Cair Paravel was in ruins. Soooooo....did they rebuild it? What happened to the Telmarine Castle? I glanced in SC and LB to see, and everyone's living at Cair Paravel in those, too.

So, if anyone knows or has any ideas, please share. Was Cair Paravel rebuilt/what happened to the Telmarine Castle? :confused:

In TLB they were in a tower thing for protection and to prepare to fight and stuff. Maybe that was something that was left from the Telmarine Castle? I mean, most people don't just build random towers in the middle of a forest.

Obviously Cair Paravel would be the obvious choice to live in, but maybe the Telmarine Castle was kept up just in case.

[~Lava~]

I agree that the Telmarine Castle was kept. Think about all the castles in England and almost all of them were used within the space of a year by the Royal family. It is also possible that Caspian gave the castle to one of the the lords when no longer needed it as the Royal palace.

Another possibility is that Caspian let his aunt and cousin continue to live in that castle after it was no longer needed. Indeed, I think it was very unlikely that Pruniprismia and the boy went through the door because it would have been very near murder to take a baby of that age to a Pacific Island with our mosquitos and everything else. Caspian, though preventing any possibility that his cousin would assume the throne, would not have treated his aunt and cousin like they were only to happy to treat him.

[Elentari]

In TLB they were in a tower thing for protection and to prepare to fight and stuff. Maybe that was something that was left from the Telmarine Castle? I mean, most people don't just build random towers in the middle of a forest.

Obviously Cair Paravel would be the obvious choice to live in, but maybe the Telmarine Castle was kept up just in case.

Good idea, but the tower is described as an outpost, not like a tower ruin type. When it comes to building outposts to watch for suspicious activity, then yes, I would say that Narnians build "random towers", though this one is not described as being IN the forest. Sorry I'm so picky, but I just finished reading LB again. :)

[Vanzetti]

Cair Paravel, I think, is a quite small castle. I can`t imagine Pevensies having a large court. So rebuilding it probably wan`t hard.

[Elentari]

Cair Paravel, I think, is a quite small castle. I can`t imagine Pevensies having a large court. So rebuilding it probably wan`t hard.

I always thought it quite large actually, though it depends on what you compare it to.

[AsbelMctalisker]

Its most likely that during the period of VOTDT that the Narnians are in the process of rebuilding Cair Parvel and Trumpkin is living there at least in part to supervise the reconstruction. Only a small part would have been rebuilt at that point, though three years is enough time to build a couple of fairly large buildings.
In `The Silver Chair` remember that there seems to still be at least one ruined tower in which the parliament of Owls takes place and that is over ninety years later. Caspian`s Cair Paravel is likely a new castle built on the ruins of the old and incorporating bits of the old structure, though I imagine it surrounded by some of the ruins of the older castle that they didnt have any use for.
As for the throne room, If it looked like it does in PC then what I think they would have done is built a new one using the foundations of the original but in a combined Telmarine/Old Narnian style with a single throne. This is placed slightly in front of the old four which have been left in a ruinious state but its one step down from them on what is now a shallow stairway down to floor level.
This would likely be the first new building reconstucted and I can imagine it more or less complete at the point Caspian sets off on the Dawn Treader.
Miraz`s castle would still remain in use as a military garrison but would decline in importance in later years, the surrounding town would likely remain the heart of the human part of Narnia however.

[waterhogboy]

Its most likely that during the period of VOTDT that the Narnians are in the process of rebuilding Cair Parvel and Trumpkin is living there at least in part to supervise the reconstruction. Only a small part would have been rebuilt at that point, though three years is enough time to build a couple of fairly large buildings.
In `The Silver Chair` remember that there seems to still be at least one ruined tower in which the parliament of Owls takes place and that is over ninety years later. Caspian`s Cair Paravel is likely a new castle built on the ruins of the old and incorporating bits of the old structure, though I imagine it surrounded by some of the ruins of the older castle that they didnt have any use for.
As for the throne room, If it looked like it does in PC then what I think they would have done is built a new one using the foundations of the original but in a combined Telmarine/Old Narnian style with a single throne. This is placed slightly in front of the old four which have been left in a ruinious state but its one step down from them on what is now a shallow stairway down to floor level.
This would likely be the first new building reconstucted and I can imagine it more or less complete at the point Caspian sets off on the Dawn Treader.
Miraz`s castle would still remain in use as a military garrison but would decline in importance in later years, the surrounding town would likely remain the heart of the human part of Narnia however.

I like this theory. It's very credible and makes alot of sense!!

[~Lava~]

I do believe that the ruinous tower had nothing to do with Cair since they had to cross a river and fly north to get to it. In addition it was only partly ruinous. An arguement could be made that it was an outpost against the giants.

[BarbarianKing]

Everyone was excited to have Narnia reborn that they all worked on rebuilding Cair in record time. By the time of VODT (3 years) It was already done!

[prince_caspian]

Cair Paravel in the book was pretty easy to repair: add some ceilings and done! (look at illustration)

[Liz]

They rebuilt Cair Paravel.
But is the Telmarine Castle ever mentioned again? Not as far as I recall.
Wonder what happened to it. Perhaps they tore it down, and used it for other buildings.

[Mozart the Meerkitten]

There is some proof they re-built Cair Paravel, I think they did too. Or maybe three years after Caspian became king they were in the process of rebuilding Cair Paravel, and by later times had finished.

I do strongly believe though that Cair Paravel was rebuilt. Some way some how they rebuilt it.;)

[~Lava~]

Cair was rebuilt, there is no question about that. I think that Miraz's Castle was probably left standing (perhaps even as a home for Pruniprismia and Caspian's Cousin since we honestly have no evidence to believe that they left and went live on the island in the Pacific). Certainly, it would profit no one to tear down that castle.